Little blue box

Original Poster
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3
I have recently rented md and at first viewing was baffled and angered by the film. I could not understand why a writer/ director would create a film that the average Joe, short of the intellectual status of Steven Hawkings, would never understand at first watch. However, my anger turned to intrigue as I looked into the other workings of David lynch and started to understand his style, and I like it! I actually gave it some good watching time an realized that it is a beautifully done film. A real thinker film in addition to all it's other qualities.

All in all, it's time for me to post some of my theories on the subjects that I can see some ,or most people are still playing with. Mainly the infamous "blue box". In my opinion I see the blue box as representing Diane's innermost secrets, desires, and fears that have been locked away and eventually lead to her demise. For this to make total sense one must believe that the "sa"(sexual abuse) theory is right on which I do. Think about it, the blue box was everywhere something associated with her suicide was. In the hat box with the money that pays for the hit on Camilla( mind you it was stashed away "hidden? in the closet). In the drawer with the gun(leading me to believe her thought of suicide were nothing new). And most significantly, In the back of winkie's(were the blue key indicating camilla's hit was placed).This is because the box was where Diane's regrets and dark secrets of past abuse was kept, threfore is associated with her demise. Because it was in fact the guilt and memories in Diane's mind that eventually killed her.


I believe the winkie's scene with tg(dan) and cd is very important to this theory. I believe that tb is Diane talking about Diane?s dream in a dream. Remember when he said I've had this dream "TWICE". Him walking in back of Winkie's signified Diane confronting one her innermost fears and and darkest secrets, the death of Camilla. When tb or Diane croaks in back of winkies, it's a foreshadow of her eventual demise resulting from her secrets of abuse surfacing in her mind, but moreso the fact that she realizes what she has done while stareing at the blue key. The bum in back represents her subconscious, id , and conscious mind all in one. DIANES SUBCONSIOUS MIND IS THE GATE KEEPER Of HER INNEMOST SECRETS I.e....sexual abuse, and the murder of Camilla,(NOTE: many people including myself believe that the key from the hit man was placed in back of winkies), in the dream the keeper of the box is the bum. In the end you see the old people escape from the box. This represents Diane?s dark secrets of past abuse, and the hit on Camilla slipping past her subconscious /the bum, into her into her reality. The box had been opened and her secrets of past abuse, that lay dormant for many years. Plus the guilt and regret of killing Cammila where free and caused Diane to end the fears and stop the repressed memories from surfacing. SILENCIO!

:eek:
May 14, 2002 10:20 AM
0 0
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3
Has someone posted this same theory before or am I just way off base on this??:confused:
May 17, 2002 3:43 PM
0 0
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 2566
DrGonzo,

Hi and welcome!

Please don't be discouraged about the "silencio" out there. The board has slowed significantly lately, and it takes thought, time and effort to go through many of these posts as well. As for myself, I just needed a break -- but I'll be back into it soon -- as will most of the others, I'm sure.

I just skimmed your post, but you've definitely got some interesting stuff in there, though. For now, I'll just add that the blue box can be said to come in many "disguises" throughout the film -- such as blue vans and even the little blue "Tout Paris" book of Aunt Ruth's.
May 17, 2002 4:01 PM
0 0
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 16
The Blue Box is a portal to the netherworld. After Betty found the blue box in her purse Rita opened it and was sucked in and passed from existence. When the bum opened the box he let out Diane's dead parents who came back to haunt her and drive her to suicide.
May 17, 2002 6:52 PM
0 0
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 1
Why can't the box be a portal and a representative of Diane's secrets, of which Camilla's murder and her own sexual abuse are a part?

I like drgonzo's theory, but also think it represents a portal, on a surface, literal sense.
May 17, 2002 8:23 PM
0 0
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 816
[QUOTE]Originally posted by K-Tel Operator
Why can't the box be a portal and a representative of Diane's secrets, of which Camilla's murder and her own sexual abuse are a part?

I like drgonzo's theory, but also think it represents a portal, on a surface, literal sense.
[/QUOTE]

Excellent point, Operator.

That would also go some way toward explaining the significance of the blue van, which appears several times and which the prostitute and her companion climb into at the end of the scene at Pink's.
May 17, 2002 10:07 PM
0 0
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 16
Well we can come up with a lot of silly box metaphors here, like the one I read about the Blue Box being television, destroying Hollywood (guess Lynch doesn't like ABC execs). Or how about the box is Diane's female box and only Camilla has the key (after all, she can't get off masturbating).

You know, to quote Sigmund Freud (or was it Groucho Marx) about cigar dreams: "Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar".
May 18, 2002 5:22 AM
0 0
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 5
I think the blue box represents Diane's Hollywood dream. She possesed it, fought hard but failed to fulil it because she had no key. On the other hand, Camilla might not have the strong desire as Diane did, but she possesed the key. Once given the opportinuty, she used her look and sexaul weapons to accomplish her goal. After Diane died, the blue box was picked up by the homeless, and dropped on the street again for other dreamers to pick up. But why did Betty gave the box to Rita in Diane's dream? Remember the singer fell while the music continued to play at the club? Perhaps she felt the cruelness of Hollywood, that she eventually gave up her dream. And when Rita opened the box, the cruel real word of Diane came in. The dreamland was actually a cruel place! This is just my theory. Not sure if it is fresh.
Aug 22, 2002 6:23 PM
0 0
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 414
I love the blue box. I watched Dune the other night and noticed something, maybe someone else has posted this before but I am too lazy to dig through 6000 plus posts so here goes. In Dune, the Gom Jabbar (sp?) box was aqua blue (the colors of Dune reminded me a lot of MD). The walls in Aunt Ruths apartment were earth tones, Dune had a lot of earth tones. The eyes of people who ate the spice in Dune were the same blue as the box in MD and although the GJ box in Dune was aqua it was still BLUE. Many people wore black clothes in Dune, certain crucial characters (Adam, Camilla/Rita) wore black in MD. But Sting, a very evil character in Dune, wore BLUE. The blue upon blue eyes in Dune could see the future. The blue box in MD takes us between worlds and timelines and levels of consciousness (dreams vs reality).

What's my point? Well, I saw some similarities between the blue box in Dune and the box in MD. In Dune, the Reverend Mother tells Paul that the aqua blue box contains pain, he knows it a mind f u c k and will have to mentally overcome the pain that it contains - he is the only man ever to have passed (and I believe even having taken) the test and it changes him after he does it. The blue box in MD also takes us from one level of consciousness to another and in some ways contains Diane's pain or it takes us to view events leading up to pain (she kills herself at the end and just before that Rita opens the blue box) or the ending of pain. But Diane was no Moahdib and couldn't mentally overcome her pain the way he was trained to do and did. I know this is way out there, but Lynch seems to have certain color themes that go from film to film that don't vary much and somehow they are all connected. I haven't totally sorted this out quite yet...
Aug 22, 2002 8:32 PM
0 0
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 51
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Zors
I love the blue box. I watched Dune the other night and noticed something, maybe someone else has posted this before but I am too lazy to dig through 6000 plus posts so here goes. In Dune, the Gom Jabbar (sp?) box was aqua blue (the colors of Dune reminded me a lot of MD). The walls in Aunt Ruths apartment were earth tones, Dune had a lot of earth tones. The eyes of people who ate the spice in Dune were the same blue as the box in MD and although the GJ box in Dune was aqua it was still BLUE. Many people wore black clothes in Dune, certain crucial characters (Adam, Camilla/Rita) wore black in MD. But Sting, a very evil character in Dune, wore BLUE. The blue upon blue eyes in Dune could see the future. The blue box in MD takes us between worlds and timelines and levels of consciousness (dreams vs reality).

What's my point? Well, I saw some similarities between the blue box in Dune and the box in MD. In Dune, the Reverend Mother tells Paul that the aqua blue box contains pain, he knows it a mind f u c k and will have to mentally overcome the pain that it contains - he is the only man ever to have passed (and I believe even having taken) the test and it changes him after he does it. The blue box in MD also takes us from one level of consciousness to another and in some ways contains Diane's pain or it takes us to view events leading up to pain (she kills herself at the end and just before that Rita opens the blue box) or the ending of pain. But Diane was no Moahdib and couldn't mentally overcome her pain the way he was trained to do and did. I know this is way out there, but Lynch seems to have certain color themes that go from film to film that don't vary much and somehow they are all connected. I haven't totally sorted this out quite yet...
[/QUOTE]

I agree with alot of what you are saying here Zors, Lynch uses color schemes to suggest or evoke feelings or emotions and to provide a heavy atmosphere in his films. His use of color is pretty consistent in his color films. I also noticed that Dune and MD have VERY similar color schemes - lots of browns, beiges, blacks, golds, and sparse pops of Red and Blue. Kubrick worked with color in a similar manner although to a different effect.
Aug 23, 2002 6:31 AM
0 0
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 64
Hey there people. A part of me thinks that the blue box is some sort of drug. Just because those little drawfs (I consider them some sort of guilt) come out of it when she wakes from her "dream" (or it could be a high) and torment Diane till she kills herself. I forget the names of the two people Betty met on the plane but they are the little people that escape from the box later on and the way they leave her at the airport with strange smiles it could be that after taking the drug all guilt leaves her. When she opens the box her drug trip comes down.

Now if any of that made sense and you think it could be a possiblity, please comment on it!
Sep 2, 2002 12:18 PM
0 0
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 1468
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Spacemonkey64
Hey there people. A part of me thinks that the blue box is some sort of drug. Just because those little drawfs (I consider them some sort of guilt) come out of it when she wakes from her "dream" (or it could be a high) and torment Diane till she kills herself. I forget the names of the two people Betty met on the plane but they are the little people that escape from the box later on and the way they leave her at the airport with strange smiles it could be that after taking the drug all guilt leaves her. When she opens the box her drug trip comes down.

Now if any of that made sense and you think it could be a possiblity, please comment on it!
[/QUOTE]

I'm not sure, but it could be. However, Rita opens the box? So perhaps it is Rita (or Camilla) who brings her out of her "high".

During her dream/high, Diane's fantasies seem to occur (her and Rita shows her desire for Camilla, and Rita's amnesia is an ultimate setup for this, because if that happened to Camilla she would forget about whatisname Justin Theroux and may fall for Diane instead. Also, Diane says something at the party about wanting to be an actress, and in her dream, she is a good one). However, they do come in a skewed, uncomfortable fashion which would be typical of a high. Also, it seems too deep to be a regular dream, and too many of her wishes appear to come true.
Sep 13, 2002 12:59 AM
0 0
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 24
[QUOTE]Originally posted by MrPhoenix


I'm not sure, but it could be. However, Rita opens the box? So perhaps it is Rita (or Camilla) who brings her out of her "high".

During her dream/high, Diane's fantasies seem to occur (her and Rita shows her desire for Camilla, and Rita's amnesia is an ultimate setup for this, because if that happened to Camilla she would forget about whatisname Justin Theroux and may fall for Diane instead. Also, Diane says something at the party about wanting to be an actress, and in her dream, she is a good one). However, they do come in a skewed, uncomfortable fashion which would be typical of a high. Also, it seems too deep to be a regular dream, and too many of her wishes appear to come true.
[/QUOTE]

Hi there. One poster saw the little blue box as the "truth", so did a guy named bill who actually made a visual synopsis of MD. I think I agree with him. After all, Betty DID disappear when Rita was about to open the blue box. Like Bill said, "the box was the truth, Betty couldn't face the truth." which is why she disappeared. The truth, I guess, would be the awful crime, the hit on Camilla/Rita.:cool:
Sep 13, 2002 1:10 AM
0 0
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 1468
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Fuma-Ley_Ar


Hi there. One poster saw the little blue box as the "truth", so did a guy named bill who actually made a visual synopsis of MD. I think I agree with him. After all, Betty DID disappear when Rita was about to open the blue box. Like Bill said, "the box was the truth, Betty couldn't face the truth." which is why she disappeared. The truth, I guess, would be the awful crime, the hit on Camilla/Rita.:cool:
[/QUOTE]

I'll think about that too

I am definitely going to have to see this movie again
Sep 13, 2002 2:17 AM
0 0
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 19
............................
Hey there people. A part of me thinks that the blue box is some sort of drug. Just because those little drawfs (I consider them some sort of guilt) come out of it when she wakes from her "dream" (or it could be a high) and torment Diane till she kills herself. I forget the names of the two people Betty met on the plane but they are the little people that escape from the box later on and the way they leave her at the airport with strange smiles it could be that after taking the drug all guilt leaves her. When she opens the box her drug trip comes down.
..............................
..............................
No, I don't think of the blue box as a sort of drug. I think Diane had plenty of things going on inside of her, her experiences & guilt, that it wouldn't need a drug to induce her into the state she's in. I guess you could be meaning it's LIKE a drug, or has the effect of a drug....hmmm maybe...'a drug that makes you dream' as the song goes, but I think it's more symbolic/representational of reality/essence/guilt.
Hmmm, maybe Rita, as Diane's dark side, didn't follow Betty's instruction 'don't drink all the coke' !! That's really the only line I can construe as possibly drug-related in any obvious sense.
Technically speaking the old people shrunk down would be considered midgets, not dwarfs, which is of course stupid for me to even bring up, but I had in my mind the various midgets & drawfs in the Wizard of OZ. I'm from Kansas, so I'm sensitive to this issue! Irene is more troll-like however....don't ya think?
I remember George Carlin saying: " the politically correct term IS 'little people', but if they're midgets & dwarfs, why can't we call 'em *****in' midgets & dwarfs???"
But I digress! sorry...
Sep 13, 2002 5:39 PM
0 0
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 56
ya know, that "don't drink all the coke" line has always bugged me. I guess the obvious answer to it is that its just one of those crazy things that you sometimes may say in a dream. Like when people talk in there sleep they say the crazy things that don't make any sense.

But there are moments that Im not so convinced it was all just a dream, so then I start to wonder if it has any meaning. Mainly because it seems so uncharacteristic of sweet, kind Betty to say. Not that she was saying it harsh in any way, I just mean that she was just so sweet and so helpful and so loving, it would be more like her to say " go ahead and have as much as you want". And I just don't picture Camilla suckin back coca cola's either, for some reason!
Sep 13, 2002 5:56 PM
0 0
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 944
[QUOTE]Originally posted by StellaBlue
ya know, that "don't drink all the coke" line has always bugged me. I guess the obvious answer to it is that its just one of those crazy things that you sometimes may say in a dream. Like when people talk in there sleep they say the crazy things that don't make any sense.

But there are moments that Im not so convinced it was all just a dream, so then I start to wonder if it has any meaning. Mainly because it seems so uncharacteristic of sweet, kind Betty to say. Not that she was saying it harsh in any way, I just mean that she was just so sweet and so helpful and so loving, it would be more like her to say " go ahead and have as much as you want". And I just don't picture Camilla suckin back coca cola's either, for some reason!
[/QUOTE]

For me, the "don't drink all the coke'" line, for me, Stella and Steelidan, didn't seem out of character, for someone like betty to say, and should not be taken out of context, because she did let out a little giggle after she said it. I think the line was just to show us that she has a "naughty" side, and being a "girly-girl" character in the "dream" , I think it's not too far-off for her to say it.

Besides, the line is too literal to me, for it to be taken as such. Esp since lynch never intends for his audience to be "spoonfed" anything.

Also, for "proving" sake, In the reality sequence, Diane never looked high. She never got that glassy look in her eyes people on dope do. She always seemed depressed, a little out-of-it, maybe, but never really 'coked-up'. Her problems were so in front of her face, I think it wouldn've been better for her if she was on drugs. Maybe she wouldn't've been so depressed, so that she tried to kill herself. I'd take drug addiction over suicide anytime. At least with the former you could rehabilitate. ;)
Sep 13, 2002 9:09 PM
0 0
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 944
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Neely O'Hara
Every time I hear Betty say <B>"and don't drink all the coke"</B>, I giggle and think to myself: "they've only been 'living together' for a day or so and they already sound like a married couple." [/QUOTE]

They did sound like a married couple Maybe it was all part of that "wishful thinking" thing. Diane wanted that domesticity that comes with "normal, healthy relationships", something she obviously did not have with Camilla, the nasty, sexy, b i t c h.
Sep 14, 2002 12:53 AM
0 0
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 893
What are we to make of the Snow White references?

Is it perhaps significant that Diane seems to be mirrored in long-shot as she stands at her kitchen sink, and undergoes a kind of traumatic hyperventilation, of desire turning into horror?

Why is Rita/Camilla a simulacrum of Snow White, complete with contemporary, tailored black and red clothing (which is fairly unlikely to have been sourced from Aunt Ruth's wardrobe)?

And didn't the evil Queen (from the more popular Snow White tales) ask her hired killer, the huntsman, to take her uncomfortably beautiful young rival into the woods and cut out her heart, and to return it in a box?

And didn't the huntsman take pity on Snow White, and kill a deer (or hart) instead, and return its heart in said box to satisfy the Queen?
Sep 14, 2002 1:38 AM
0 0
DR.
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 252
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Neely O'Hara

EXACTLY!

I really thought it smacked of Diane's wish for that everyday, 'domestic intimacy'......and it always makes me smile for some reason
[/QUOTE]

Neely and Sphygmo,
with ya on this I tried to explain this on a thread called outside. I thought that" Diane's wish for the everday domestic intimacy" also showed up in the fact that Betty and Rita also spent so much time outside. Diane and Camilla we really only see inside except for the party scene, and Camilla standing in the doorway(don't make it be like this) Someone pointed out that it would be hard to gauge because we see more of Betty and Rita then Diane and Camilla. That is true but I still get that impression that it has more to do with Diane's desire for a real relationship and not just a sexual relationship that is implied she had with Camilla. "mabe, mabe, mabe"
Sep 14, 2002 8:58 AM
0 0